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Groomers BBS » Breed Styles and Grooming Techniques » MIXED-BREED GROOMING » Labradoodle and Goldendoodle Grooming « Previous Next »

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choochie
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Username: choochie

Post Number: 58
Registered: 4-2006
Posted From: 67.83.46.188
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 9:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I hope that some pet owners read this thread before they get one of these dogs and before they go to the groomer. I had a labradoodle come in this week which was matted, very matted. IF the owner can't get a comb through the dog, it is matted. If the dog has a long coat, it is more likely to matt. So, the owner tells me the previous groomer shaved her dog down. I tell her the dog was probably matted. So, I have the dog on the table, talk to her on the phone, and yes, this time the dog is matted again and she will be SHORT, although not pink. We finish the dog with a 4 - not bad. The customer comes and says, "You told me this wouldn't happen." Oiy, I tell her we are at square one, brush your dog regularly and as long as there are no matts, the dog can stay long. Other things she said is that she read the dog should be 1" long on the body, 2" long on the legs. How "should" a dog be - a pet can be any length- shorter if the owner doesn't want a lot of brushing and maintenance. She also mentioned that she heard regular bathing is not good for teh dog. Not true in my opinion, and a labradoodle is a cross between TWO water dogs. Lastly, she said she does not want her dog to look like a poodle. Well, considering it is half poodle with a coat identical to a poodle - you tell me the dog doesn't look like a poodle.
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gone2dogs
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Username: gone2dogs

Post Number: 1147
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 156.34.178.64
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 9:36 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

People stink...lol I let people know it works only one way...the shorter the hair the less you have to brush! The longer the hair the MORE you have to brush. Lordy, my 3 yr old could figure that out!
When people call and yang about how the last groomed shaved i asked if there were any matts...of course they cry out, 'NOO!!!', My response to their usual lie? 'Okey dokey! As long as I can get a fine tooth comb through their hair we can leave them as long as you like...' Suddenly I hear, 'Well you won't get that through....' Then comes the repetitive lecture of WHY we shave...not cause we want to but because the owner really wants me to...lol
I love my job, I love my job....I keep saying it and dreaming of brushed out dogs...
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 12
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 2:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Groomers. Doodle owner (and DIY groomer) here. I lurk (and learn) here, and post on rare occasion.

Can I offer a suggestion (and a little info)? Hopefully this thread can stay on topic and not escalate to the usual bashing of all things doodle.

For any first-time doodle clients, arrange for them to come by for a "consult" at a time convenient to your grooming shedule. Those of you who have groomed a few doodles know that there's significant variations in coats. Many doodle owners are not well educated about coat maintenance and care.

Labradoodles
Some F1 Labradoodles (poodle x lab) are pretty low maintenance. The rest of the F1 Labradoodles, and most all F1B Labradoodles (poodle x labradoodle) require regular brushing and grooming.

Goldendoodles (I've got one of these)
Most all Goldendoodles are F1, some are F1Bs. All Goldendoodles (IMO) require regular brushing/combing and grooming.

Australian Labradoodles
These are multigenerational dogs, with a few other breeds (besides labs and poodles) infused into their lines. I'm not really familar with the necessary care for these, but I do know that some of the ALD sites are the proponents of "don't bathe too often."

Most doodles go through a coat change somewhere between 8 and 18 months of age, when unless the dog is cut short, you're likely to get overnight matts, even if you brush 2x a day.

Yikes... This is getting long. My point is, lumping all these doodles together isn't a good idea, as they all require a different level of care. Add to that different level of owner care (or neglect, if you will) and (if I were a groomer) I would be uncomfortable saying anything conclusive over the phone without seeing the dog.

OK, during the consult: Have them bring their brushes and combs. Show the owner what you mean by matting. Here's a great opportunity for you to sell some merchandise (brushes and combs, mattbusters and your favorite finishing/detangling spray), and educate the owner as to the proper way to use all the stuff you just sold them. Explain to them that combing out matts is very painful and stressful for the dog (you can choose whether or not to share how much it sucks for you too, if you think they'll be receptive.) If the dog looks well cared for, congratulate the owner on a job well done, and move on to how they'd like their doodle cut. For the other 95% of the "first time" doodles, explain that the cut down is the best thing for the dog, and gives them (the dog and owner) a clean slate to start with. Tell them to brush regularly, even though the dog won't need it at first. Explain that their dog will need brushing x times a week to maintain a matt free coat. Remind them to check for matts with the fine tooth comb.

To answer the question about "don't make it look like a poodle" that means (IMO) "no clean feet", "no shaved muzzle", "no pronounced top knot" and "no pom tail". Think puppy or teddy bear cut, but get the client to be specific about length (if they've earned it by presenting you a brushed out dog.)

Here's how I like to keep my doodle in the summertime (and before I bought a grooming table LOL):


Winnie (Goldendoodle Summer Trim)
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progroom
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Username: progroom

Post Number: 4520
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 68.93.178.30
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 3:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Great job on the groom!

You are correct, consulting with the owner and showing them the matting is ideal. Unfortunately, many owners (of all breeds not just doodles *g*) still can't understand the work involved in keeping the coat.

I have sat many times with owners and dogs and a comb and showed them how it would not go through the coat. I've showed them that you can't see the skin through the pelting, and they still do not understand.

I don't really blame them. They are not experienced in coat care. They read breed websites that do not fully disclose the amount of coat care required. Unless they are doing it every day, it is very hard for them to see and feel a matted coat vs a combed coat.

Again, great job on the groom.

Barb
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animalhouse
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Username: animalhouse

Post Number: 128
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 207.144.204.156
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 3:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I agree with both of you!!...love the groom and would think that cut would work for someone who don't want a poodle look-a-like....I give out a sheet on care for that type of beed what ever it be and also an explaination of my charges for dematting and when the coat is beyond dematting and needs to be removed...after I started this I have had no complaints of " OMG you shaved her"...this works for me..people around here learn more when they can read it--Barb
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gone2dogs
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Username: gone2dogs

Post Number: 1149
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 156.34.178.64
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 5:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

My fav is when you tell them they HAVE to brush them daily and they tell you, :I can't Princess bites me..." But they cannot understand whyI would want to shave off that lovely pelt when I could wave my magic wand and dematt her....sigh.
There are not enough dog owners like you Winnies Dad.
People also think their breeders word is law...so when i see websites that claim some dogs need little to no grooming I want to call and yell a little (but I don't, I do have some manners, lol)
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doggygirl
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Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 746
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 156.34.178.229
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 5:17 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

All that advice is great but years in the biz I think most of do that and not just with doodle types. The breeders say the dogs should never be shaved but don't mention brushing. To a rational person that is good info but it seems we often deal with people who just don't, or won't get it.
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bbird
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Username: bbird

Post Number: 316
Registered: 3-2000
Posted From: 69.9.29.5
Posted on Monday, September 17, 2007 - 7:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I operate much the way Winnie's dad is suggesting, with a grooming consultation prior to the first groom so that we can assess together the condition of the coat and the dog's tolerance for detangling. I usually use a small HV dryer on low power to look into the coat and see what shape it is in.

I don't attempt to get a fine toothed comb through this type of coat, but prefer to use a big poodle comb (the kind on a wood handle). If I can get that comb through most of the coat, I can groom without significant problems. I use a Mat Breaker tool on thick matted areas and we see how well the coat comes apart and if the dog can tolerate. Based on what I see and how the dog acts, we come up with a plan.

I always like to evaluate the owners tools and products and make recommendations, which I tie into sales. I highly recommend the Chris Christensen 16 mm T-brush for Doodles.

If owners are wanting length, they must agree to a regular 4-week grooming. If the coat care starts to get away from them, we can go to shorter intervals or a shorter trim. On most of my Doodles, I use a #A snap-on with a clipper vac or larger, depending.

I don't think it's fair to generalize about all owners or breeders. There are Goldendoodle breeders who are very realistic with owners as well as some who minimize the grooming work. When my mother was breeding Lhasa Apsos, we used to provide a grooming kit and complete instructions on how to lay the puppy on its side and line brush, and she would carefully explain and demo the whole process. If the prospective owner was not willing to commit to weekly grooming, she would not let them have a puppy. There are plenty of breeders like that.

Here is a picture of a Doodle that I do..

Goldendoodle Groom
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doggygirl
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Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 749
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 156.34.178.118
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 4:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We have one doodle breeder around here and she isn't giving brushing lessons or anything of the sort. Our local t.v. station had a show about her and they got the most mail/calls and e-mails enraged that this station would be promoting this glorified mutt and I don't mean that in a nasty way(because I have adopted mutts, myself).. Of course when people (I) say "breeders" they KNOW there are some who are great about educating clients.

(Message edited by doggygirl on September 18, 2007)
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kaymay
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Username: kaymay

Post Number: 35
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.11.193.117
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 7:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I was in a pet supply store with my roommate, who is also a groomer, and we saw a book on golden doodles and it said, I swear, "Do not let your groomer tell you your doodle needs to be shaved".

Okay then......
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nkswen
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Username: nkswen

Post Number: 338
Registered: 10-2001
Posted From: 68.0.42.49
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 8:02 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess it's just me but when you decide to purchase a dog common sense has to take over at some point. I do a number of doodles, golden and lab. Every one had to be shaved on the first visit. They are now all on a very tight schedule and kept in Teddy Bear clips. My doodle prices start at 85.00 and go higher. I have a customer with a Labradoodle that looks like a large terrier and I have another customer with a Labradoodle that looks like a small Standard Poodle that blows coat like a husky. Go figure. :-) I treat all my customers the same...doodle owner or not. I used to be surprized when an owner refused to believe when their pet was matted. Now I know they choose to be selective in this department. I have had Drs. give me that famous blank stare when I told them Fido would have to be shaved. The blank stare went away when I put Fido on the table with the hv on low and went inch by inch over the coat. This shows every matt and tangle and build up of undercoat. Sorry, but the buck stops with the owner of the breed they decide to buy...doodles included.
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groomnpoodles
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Username: groomnpoodles

Post Number: 631
Registered: 3-2002
Posted From: 71.32.150.14
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 8:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Your doodle is lucky to have you for an owner, winniesdad. I have several doodles here -- and a couple of mini-doodles-- and each and every one of them were told by the breeder that they dogs wouldn't shed and were very low-maintenance. Unfortunately, they found out too late that this isn't true. I explain to them about how genetics dictates what type of coat their doodle gets, just like it does for us humans. As I am explaining to the owner, I can see the 'light go on' and they get it. Breeders are a large part of the owner mis-information. I have some great owners here and they are by and large great at coat maintenance, since they now understand WHY they have to brush and WHY I won't demat. The HV is an invaluable tool for exposing all those mats, isn't it??!!!!
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 13
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 69.138.2.149
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 8:36 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Here's what my Goldendoodle book says on the second page of the grooming chapter:
"A word to the wise for those who use professional groomers: be sure to tell your groomer precisely how you wish your Doodle to look. Many groomers do not know exactly what to do with a Goldendoodle, and you don't wan to leave your dog at the grooming salon only to return and find him completely shaved down."

The second sentence on the first page says:
"The coat should be brushed and combed daily or groomed regularly by a professional."

Unfortunately they leave it to the reader to infer that if you do not commit to regular brushing and combing then you don't have much of a choice on whether or not the dog should be shaved.

I paid $75.00 for Winnie's only professional grooming. I thought this was a reasonable price. I had found the perfect groomer, but sadly, she closed her shop later that year. I decided to become Winnie's groomer, because we do Therapy Dog work, and I need to keep her pretty tidy. I bathe her at least twice a month, due to visiting requirements.

Thanks for the compliments on my grooming job. I call her my "chia dog". I enjoy grooming her, but in doing so, I have gained respect for all you groomers out there. It is HARD work, but still enjoyable.
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doggygirl
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Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 752
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 156.34.165.57
Posted on Tuesday, September 18, 2007 - 4:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Awesome!! I am thinking of getting one of my Border Terriers in to pet therapy:-)
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 14
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 10:44 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

bbird,
Thanks so much for the recommendation on the Chris Christensen 16 mm T-brush. I just got one, and LOVE it! Funny thing is, I had a 27mm Oval CC brush, and it didn't really do much at all. The combination of longer pins and flexier pad makes the 27mm oval have too much "give". The 16mm T is really nice. It is hard to describe, it is almost like it is a combination of a brush, a comb, and a slicker, all in one. I see it getting lots of use, and is my new "go to" brush. Winnie seems to like it better than my double Purple LesPooch. To me, it feels like I'm getting to her skin more, and the shape of the head is nice, allowing me to get into her "problem areas" where the matts like to form(around neck, behind ears, armpits, etc)

I'll be recommending this brush to other doodle owners.

Thanks again.

doggygirl: Pet therapy is very rewarding. If you have the time, go for it.
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yorkees
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Username: yorkees

Post Number: 1850
Registered: 8-2000
Posted From: 69.19.14.45
Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 11:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just out of curiousity, why is it that the word 'doodle' changes anything at all about regular grooming and owners' home care for their dog? The poodle mixed breeds have been around since the first poodle jumped a fence, and have been around forever... and they have always come in all coat types and all sizes....
Some breeders of these mixed dogs are in too much of a hurry to sell them as 'shedless' and 'hypoallergenic' and easy to maintain and thats where the problem comes in...the buying public believes the hype and of course they get P.O.ed when they drop off their dog to be groomed and the groomer clips it short because it IS matted to the skin...
winnies dad, I commend you for taking the time to groom at home, trust me, after 40 years in grooming I can say without a doubt you are an exceptional owner, most owners try for a few months and then give it up...and then tell their friends and relatives that the mean old groomer shaved their dog for no reason...

Doodles of ANY sort of cross are just big hairy dogs and all groomers are used to grooming well maintained hairy dogs or neglected hairy dogs..

It all boils down to what we groomers DO TRY to do, and that is to educate the pet-owning public on how to keep their dog looking good by regular maintenance and home brushing........
BTW, you did do a good job on your own dog!
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lindsey
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Username: lindsey

Post Number: 410
Registered: 6-2003
Posted From: 71.2.128.222
Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 1:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Great job Winnies' Dad, its great to see an owner take things into their own hands and educate themselves. Its also nice to hear from the other side of the leash, if you know what I mean, and see that there are owners out there that dont get defensive the minute you mention grooming/shaving their doodle. Doodle or not, when it comes down to it, every coated dog needs regular care and brushing if a longer style is desired. So many doodle owners jump down your throat when they think you are bashing their breed and telling them they need to be brushed or be shaved (and bring out their doodle books). I would give the same speech I give to doodle owners that I would give to any breed's owner that comes in with a large, matted dog. On the other hand, I do agree that we as groomers often get rather touchy when it comes to 'designer dogs', and sometimes for good reason, but as professionals we need to make sure that we are dealing with clients who own these 'breeds' with tact, and not getting an attitude right off the bat with them. Yes, alot of them ARE ignorant about the care involved for their dog's coat type, due to misinformation from 'breeders' and books, but then again so are alot of purebred owners. The best bet is to do the consultation method like mentioned above. Put the dog on the table, show the owner what we are talking about. Like it or not, doodles and mixes are only going to get more popular, and thats just more money in our pockets when it comes down to it. We don't have to like them, we just have to groom them to the best of our ability. :-) Anyhow, not quite sure why I am on the soapbox, but glad to get it out. I am in no way a supporter of making new breeds, but I am not going to alienate a client that chooses to get one (I just strongly encourage them to educate themselves first, and search for someone who does health testing on their breeding animals). Ok, getting off the soapbox now...
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englishsettlement
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Username: englishsettlement

Post Number: 3
Registered: 12-2007
Posted From: 71.193.85.21
Posted on Sunday, December 2, 2007 - 6:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I dont see anything wrong with coming up with new breeds. Alot of the old breeds have no 'real' jobs left in our working lives. I LOVE goldendoodles (everyone at my salon is happy I do because they can book them with me without fear). It's just a blank slate to create new styles. I dont condone irresponsible breeding though, or passing along the idea that the dogs are low maintenance. The 'I dont want him to look like a poodle' has been a fun challenge! There's one doodle owner whose dog has about 8" of fur now and she keeps her brushed OUT. Each one that comes in has different possibilities. LOVE it!
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coonhound
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Username: coonhound

Post Number: 1
Registered: 6-2008
Posted From: 98.201.166.178
Posted on Sunday, July 6, 2008 - 10:21 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Winnis Dad,
What does PWD stand for? I am a baby groomer.
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cockerlover04
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Username: cockerlover04

Post Number: 65
Registered: 4-2008
Posted From: 69.58.224.75
Posted on Sunday, July 6, 2008 - 10:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I don't see where you see that at on this thread, but maybe Portugese water Dog?
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doggygirl
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Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 3757
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 156.34.182.42
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 4:35 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

are baby's easier to groom? :-)
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theposhpet
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Username: theposhpet

Post Number: 632
Registered: 7-2006
Posted From: 65.185.69.197
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 8:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ROFL @ DG!!!
Live your life in such a way that when your feet hit the floor in the morning, Satan shudders & says... 'Oh s#*%....she's awake!!'-anonymous email
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miss_k
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Username: miss_k

Post Number: 138
Registered: 3-2008
Posted From: 76.252.48.6
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 4:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

PWD means Portuguese Water Dog. :-)
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gone2dogs
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Username: gone2dogs

Post Number: 2351
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 156.34.186.21
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 6:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Babies are slippier then dogs when wet, lol
They are also really awful with any trained commands...
There is a method to my madness...
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coonhound
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Username: coonhound

Post Number: 2
Registered: 6-2008
Posted From: 98.201.166.178
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 10:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Please someone explain what DIY groomer, F1, F1B, IMO stand for. Am I supposed to have known these already?
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letmrun
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Username: letmrun

Post Number: 43
Registered: 10-2004
Posted From: 24.59.60.128
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 10:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

DIY stands for "Do It Yourself" -- like in home repairs. So a non-pro who does all the grooming himself.
F1 = genetics-speak for first generation cross
F1B = result of crossing back an F1 offspring to one of the parent stocks (one of the original breeds, in dogs).
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 47
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 69.138.29.144
Posted on Monday, July 7, 2008 - 11:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hello coonhound,
Sorry if I went a little crazy with the abbreviations. Everyone has explained them nicely here.

Oh wait they missed one:
IMO = In my opinion

Do you have many doodle clients?
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groominchick
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Username: groominchick

Post Number: 487
Registered: 9-2004
Posted From: 68.217.130.144
Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 7:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have 2 standard poodle clients and about 7 doodles of various types. No offense Winnies Dad. I just think it is sad.
Bloom where you are planted
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 48
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.45
Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 10:45 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

No offense taken. I'm confused. What is sad?
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papsnpaints
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Username: papsnpaints

Post Number: 2308
Registered: 5-2005
Posted From: 24.225.16.131
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 8:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have my first goldendoodle client today. The dog is five months old, about 35 pounds, been to puppy kindergarten and beautifully kept up at home. I'm so pleased the client is knowledgeable and wants to do the best for her dog. The dog is adorable and I can't wait for the chance to do a full groom, this is bath, face, bum and feet.
“People often tell me that motivation doesn't last, and I tell them bathing doesn't either, that's why I recommend it daily!” - Zig Ziglar
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progroom
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Username: progroom

Post Number: 5960
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 69.148.244.221
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 10:07 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

That sounds EXACTLY like the new client I booked yesterday. I won't see him until mid February.

All she has read says not to get a hair cut until they are a year old.(we did discuss this) She has been getting bath and tidies done every 2 - 4 weeks and really likes the look.

The dog has been to classes, and they work with him at home. She didn't even flinch at the VERY high price I quoted.

He will be my first too.

Barb
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 49
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.44
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 1:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm glad you two got some "good" clients. Not all doodle owners are clueless, and some of the clueless ones are open to learning.

About the "one year" thing. I think that stems from the fact that you can have a doodle pup, and keep up with the brushing, and have a matt free doodle until the dreaded coat change. Then, overnight, the war against the matts is lost. Of course here, I'd be preaching to the choir to say that these two owners are doing the right thing by getting the dog used to the groomer and the grooming process before that happens. Winnie's first full groom was at about 8 months, and I guess I timed it well, because her coat change was not very problematic.

You should recommend your clients get the Chris Christensen 16 mm T-brush that bbird suggested I get (above in this very thread!). That thing is fabulous. Better yet, keep a few on hand in your storefront.
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royalgoldens
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Username: royalgoldens

Post Number: 96
Registered: 3-2008
Posted From: 161.155.190.111
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 1:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey Winnies dad, first, I also want to congratulate you on a job well done with your dog! It is a shame you don't take her to a groomer, because you would be anyone's favorite customer!
I also want to ask what it was that made you pick a doodle? I don't ask to be mean or anything, I am really just curious, and you are probably the most well educated doodle owner I have come across, so a great person for me to ask.
I find that so many people are quick to jump on the doodle bandwagon, praising the good points, but yet these same people seem to have some deep seeded disdain for poodles (like you just mention them and they scrunch their noses and go ewwwee pooodddllleeesss!)
I ask them why a doodle and they say good temperment, non shedding, big sweet dog. Well, poodles meet all of the above criteria, and non shedding is guaranteed, unlike a doodle where it could go either way.
So some people say they don't like foofoo poodle haircuts, so they got a doodle. But I guess they don't realize that a poodle can be groomed with a fuzzy face and feet too (or like a giraffe, buffalo, ninja turtle, peacock, chicken, kerry blue terrier, bedlington, bichon etc etc).
I have one grooming client who I talked to on the phone for over an hour discussing doodles vs poodles before she got a pup, and I found her a well bred white poodle puppy at a reasonable price. They said no, they could never have a white dog, it would be dirty and stained because of running on all their land.
Well they got a WHITE F1B doodle (and paid more for it), and they have it groomed like a poodle (everything but clean feet, I talked them out of that because of her big fat golden like feet). It looks like a long bodied, wide faced standard poodle, with a long tail. And they are still clueless about matting after a year and a half of my trying soo hard. So she just gets a 3 or 4 all over depending on what I can get thru her coat at the time. They have brought their brushes and combs in, I have saved the matted pelt and given it back to them, showing how the top looks fine, but see what the underside looks like at the skin? I have demo'd technique etc etc. All for naught.
They are happy with her, so I am happy for them, but sometimes I just don't understand people's decisions.
So, winnies dad, maybe you can help me understand what doodles have to offer that poodles (or goldens) don't have.
Again, please don't take this wrong, I don't mean anything negative by it! I'll admit, I am skeptical about doodles, but I'd like to better understand where my doodle loving clients are coming from.
I have both goldens and standard poodles, and love both breeds dearly, but couldn't imagine mixing them.
Thanks!
Michelle
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 51
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.44
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 2:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Michelle,
I'll try to answer your question.

Let's see, my first 3 dogs were mutts, strays in fact. The first one was a spaniel mix, the second was a terrier-ish dog, and the 3rd appeared to be a shrunken GSD (about 20 lbs!). After that we chose a pure-bred English Springer Spaniel. We chose the Springer because it was a medium-sized kid-friendly dog (we were planning to start a family at the time). The mini-gsd, was NOT kid friendly, but that could easily be attributed to my lack of dog training knowledge at the time. When Sally crossed the bridge, my wife didn't want another Springer. (something like: "there will never be another Sally, so we need something different.")

I have mild allergies, and we like medium to large dogs. Some of the dogs on our shopping list were PWDs, and Wheaten and Tibetan Terriers. My in-laws have had Goldens for about 20 years, and we love them, but not all the shedding. I've also heard too many sad stories of people whose Goldens have died at an early age from cancer. I'm not sure why Std. Poodle didn't get on the short list. I like poodles, and obviously they fit most of my criteria. Another thing I was looking for in a dog was one that I could do therapy dog work with. There's plenty of all of those breeds doing therapy dog work, but there's also lots of therapy doodles out there (including Winnie).

Because I don't have any AKC background (other than registering Sally the Springer) the idea of crossing breeds does not go against my grain. I know that the "best of both breeds" hype is just that, you could end up with the "worst of both breeds". In my opinion the Golden Retriever and the Std. Poodle are two breeds that posess most of what I like in a dog, so the idea of "rolling the genetic dice" and getting a combo of the two was appealing to me.

Winnie is definitely a cross of the two, both physically and personality wise. She's got retriever feet, she came "pre-programmed" to fetch. She LOVES to swim. She has long, graceful poodle legs, and her body (especially her chest) is very poodley. She floats when she trots, almost prances. She also has a very poodley head. She's kinda a "wide body" poodle. She's extremely friendly, almost to a fault. She loves attention, but she also is happy to sit out on our deck by herself. She's very smart, and minds well, most of the time, but she's also full of mischief, and will get into trouble if you don't keep her busy or tired.

So, I guess why I chose a Goldendoodle is because something between and Golden Retriever and a Standard Poodle was exactly what I wanted?

Is she an easy dog to own? No! I'd hate to think what she'd be like if left untrained. Keeping up with her coat takes lots of time and effort. But if you put forth enough effort, a goldendoodle is a wonderful dog to share your life with. People just look at her and smile. She brings joy to all she encounters.

I hope that answers your question.
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royalgoldens
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Username: royalgoldens

Post Number: 97
Registered: 3-2008
Posted From: 65.27.201.161
Posted on Wednesday, January 28, 2009 - 11:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks Winnies dad, that was a very good answer! I appreciate it! I have never heard most of those reasons, and they make the most sense of any I have heard. I am glad Winnie has brought you so much joy!
Michelle
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3dogs
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Username: 3dogs

Post Number: 529
Registered: 6-2002
Posted From: 71.2.89.3
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 1:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I just did 1 of my Doodles that I haven't seen in 3 months. He is a large guy, Curled coat with lots of undercoat. Really a Coat that requires daily brushing, removal of collar etc... to get rid of the tight mats that form at the skin but the dog looks o.k at the surface level. These people also bough a Poodle comb from me so that they could keep up with the knots at the skin level. They have always been 8 week clients & I guess with Christmas let it go. He was a mat but the owners didn't see it & wanted him in Full Scissor Coat. About 3 hours it took me to get out all the mats while drying. I had to put him away since I didn't book him as a 3 hr job. Worked on my Shih for 1 Hr. then pulled him back out to do the Scissor work only about 40min. Anyway, the owners were mad since I charged them $25 extra for the demat. I really think I am going to start charging an hourly fee on this large of a dog & Coat. Because I could have easily done 4 small dogs in the same amount of time earned 160 beans in stead of 80beans & I wouldn't have had a broken backache from it. I will learn some day.
On the other hand I have a client with 2 rescues with totally different coats. The 1 having a coat like the one above (a bear) & the other is the easiest, straightest coat out there & he never gets a scissor only a tidy on his head. They come with their 3 other rescues every 5 weeks & mom does a great job with the coats 5 hairy dogs, all rescues 2 Doodles, 1 yorkiepoo, 1 Shih-Tzu & 1 Lhasa- That is a great deal of brushing for 1 person but she does a great job & is upset if there are mats in any of them.
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rpg
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Username: rpg

Post Number: 1197
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 199.246.2.10
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 2:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

3dogs:
The easiest way to get the owners to acknowledge the matting is to hand them the comb and say - if you can get the comb through (to the skin) I can give you the style you wish. The comb doesn't go through; you get what can be done only.
I had a client who made a comment that she never thought Fido was as matted as I always found him to be (as in I am making it up). So, from that moment on I ran the comb through him on check in and if I found a single knot; would get her to run the comb through him right then and there (especially where I knew the knot to be. Proof in HER hand!
Works for me. Every client in the door gets a comb through them in front of the client.
Just as on another thread; every dog walks in and walks out..... no lameness blamed on me.....
Helpful?
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 52
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.44
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 2:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

@rpg
I think your approach is good. It lets the client know up front that there are issues that need to be addressed that will either include a shave down or (if you're willing to offer) more $$$ for you to dematt. I think most clients get grumbly when they come back to find a shaved dog, or an increased price, when they dropped off the dog expecting normal price and look.

I completely understand the groomers perspective on this, and your "comb test" is a great way to alert the client up front that they will not be getting the normal price or look.
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royalgoldens
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Username: royalgoldens

Post Number: 98
Registered: 3-2008
Posted From: 65.27.201.161
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 4:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I would never just shave a dog down without telling/warning an owner first. If I find matts at check in, we discuss our options then, so that they know what to expect. If somehow I miss them, and they are bad, then I will call the owner and discuss. If the matting is too much for me to demat in one sitting, I will offer to shave, or that they can take the dog home and brush it out themselves over a few days and then bring the dog back. They always opt for shave. This applies to any breed.
I hear so many stories about taking the dog to the groomer expecting a cute haircut and coming back to find their dog skinned (matted or not, no excuse for shocking people like that). I can't imagine doing that to a customer. Its no wonder people can be scared to take their dog to the groomer!(never mind the other horror stories)
Michelle
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ppe
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Username: ppe

Post Number: 17
Registered: 9-2008
Posted From: 99.230.196.141
Posted on Thursday, January 29, 2009 - 5:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

agree with royalgoldens, for some breed I always ask how long the hair is now and when is the last time he was professional groomed. I warn them if hair is matted we will shave. Very often I tell them such as" if this baby don't come back for a treatment for 4 weeks he will very likely to be matted so we have to cut it short" sure this drive away some customers but at least I don't have to be stressed out dematting
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sharonlf2003
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Username: sharonlf2003

Post Number: 12
Registered: 12-2008
Posted From: 71.7.240.236
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 7:32 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I got a new client yesterday with 12 week old Goldendoodle. I think he's going to be a great client. Had to get her an "emergency" bath as she had messed in her cage and rolled all in it. He was very surprised at the actual length of her coat once it was brushed out and asked me oodles of questions. He was very receptive to my explanations about proper coat upkeep, maintenance yadda yadda. The puppy herself was a sweetheart, only didn't like being rinsed off but did not mind me getting her wet initially or shampooing. Tolerated the dryer like it was in another room, I even did her nails. I booked him in again for 8 weeks, he was initially not going to book he said the breeder told him not to have her groomed until she was 8 months but that this bath was an exception because of the mess. I explained that I didn't have to bath her unless she needs it but she should be brought in to make sure she is brushed fully out, clip her nails if they need them, check her ears and to keep her used to the grooming process. So we'll see



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laughing
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Username: laughing

Post Number: 275
Registered: 10-2008
Posted From: 71.179.75.235
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 11:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What a transformation! You did a beautiful job with her.
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3dogs
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Username: 3dogs

Post Number: 531
Registered: 6-2002
Posted From: 71.2.89.3
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 11:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

These people have a huge Poodle comb that they bought from me since the first time they came in I took out the comb & showed them the mats. The dog is good & I saved the coat the 1st time. Since then I do take the comb out & check & yes the dog has mats but often times when going shorter for summer "0" boot I just bring the mats far enough off the skin to get my snap-on under the mats without having to demat the whole area.
This time it was just poor grooming on their part & I did take a comb out to them & showed them areas of mats & they were discussing longer "F" or short "0" & they decided to go longer & I said "We'll see what we can do". I often leave that decision up to the dog. If they can tolerate a demat I will if not then they go with a closer clip (not shaved).. He is a great dog & they are good customers so I will try my best it is just that my best & the dogs best took us about 3 1/2- 4 hrs to do instead of the usual 2 hrs for this dog.
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gone2dogs
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Username: gone2dogs

Post Number: 3060
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 156.34.188.192
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 6:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I dont care what the breed but I carry a comb in my pocket for check in....I use it to tell ME how long it will take me to groom the dog and it does show people what 'lies beneath'.

Most people are shocked so I give them the ol' Brushes lie and combs tell the truth.' People can understand that and understand wher ei am coming from.

I too will not shave a dog and not tell the owner. If I have to go short I explain WHY.
There is a method to my madness...
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rls
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Username: rls

Post Number: 1901
Registered: 4-2001
Posted From: 71.55.221.131
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 7:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Here's a Labradoodle I do. She is a #1 comb on body and shaved face, #7 ears, and visor.

http://www.axcessmypics.com/photos/photo03/54/3e/c2c9ac82aeaa.jpg
http://www.axcessmypics.com/photos/photo03/10/d6/9efad0ac2f87.jpg
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twiggy
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Username: twiggy

Post Number: 460
Registered: 1-2003
Posted From: 76.186.241.221
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 7:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was always matted,mom finally agreed to a shorter haircut, Never touch the ears or tail
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pampurdpups
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Username: pampurdpups

Post Number: 703
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 75.24.64.58
Posted on Friday, January 30, 2009 - 9:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

that dog would look absolutely adorable with short ears. But you did a wonderful CLEAN job, good work!
The same goes for everyone else, beautiful!

I did this one today..was a very very good boy..cept he was a little lazy near the end, lol.

Apparently someone has been chopping at his legs, but he had no mats at all. Very well kept.




Here he is as a puppy. I groomed him shortly after this picture was taken, but he wasn't so well behaved then, lol.
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twiggy
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Username: twiggy

Post Number: 510
Registered: 1-2003
Posted From: 76.186.241.221
Posted on Friday, February 6, 2009 - 12:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Way too cute. Nice work all, We will eventually conquer all those uneducated doodle owners. Until the next cross breed hooorah! (old english sheepdog and coton de tulear,you know it is going to be the size of the first with the coat of the second ugggg)
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nakedbacon
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Username: nakedbacon

Post Number: 1341
Registered: 7-2002
Posted From: 209.196.226.120
Posted on Friday, February 6, 2009 - 1:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

pampurd - that puppy has the SWEETEST brown puppydog eyes!!
"Do not remove a fly from your friend's forehead with a hatchet." - chinese proverb
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eileen
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Username: eileen

Post Number: 26
Registered: 8-2006
Posted From: 68.195.111.248
Posted on Monday, February 9, 2009 - 4:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am sorry Winnie's dad but I have to say
I have quite a few goldendoodles, it must be the area but they are all crazy and the owners cannot understand brushing and insist on keeping them long. I try but after a certain point, you can't demat. I really want to change my price for goldendoodles to $1000.
I wish you were in my area so I had one good one.
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winnies_dad
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Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 53
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.45
Posted on Monday, February 9, 2009 - 5:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

@eileen,
Sorry to hear about that. Maybe you should hold a "how to maintain your doodle if you want to keep a long coat" clinic at your shop. Sell everyone combs, brushes and finishing spray on the way out the door. Serve snickerdoodles and cheese doodles as snacks. ;o)

Just last week, I buzzed Winnie down to 1/2 inch because we both were tired of dealing with the matts.
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choochie
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Username: choochie

Post Number: 111
Registered: 4-2006
Posted From: 68.197.15.133
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 1:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Got a new goldendoodle in today. It's a super fluffy puppy they don't want "short." The lady tells me the last groomer shaved her down. But with all the brushing she has been doing, her DH says there is no way the dog should be shaved down. Well guess what. The matted mess was shaved down, per her approval. She mutters, "Oh God," when she sees the dog. Then tells me when I told her on the phone the dog needed to be shaved, she cried. And tisk, tisk, the dog looks like a poodle. I told her she is part poodle ya know. Gosh, I finished the dog with a 4 skip. Why are all these doodle people the same???
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groomsathome2
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Username: groomsathome2

Post Number: 509
Registered: 4-2006
Posted From: 64.12.116.131
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 2:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Why are all these doodle people the same???

Because they read and believed the "low maintenance" information on the website peddling these guys for $$$$$.

Can you blame them, though? If the breeders were honest and they did any research at ALL before buying them, they'd find out that the price of that rare "doodle" is far less than the cumulative cost of grooming.
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progroom
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Username: progroom

Post Number: 6091
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 66.142.41.129
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 2:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You really can't blame them. Buyers are told to go to the internet and research breeds and breeders. They research and find breeder websites telling them the wonders of the breed. They trust them because they are breeders, they MUST know what they are talking about.

But in all honesty, whenever a breed gets popular we run into the same kinds of problems. Oh how many pelted 8 month old Shih Tzus I've had to shave over the years. I imagine they all came in wanting the dog in a 1 inch puppy cut.

Most people have no idea the care required for any coated breed.

IMO it's up to us to educate them as nicely as possible.

Barb
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beth2
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Username: beth2

Post Number: 538
Registered: 4-2007
Posted From: 74.34.7.82
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 3:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

barb is so right! And just my two cents worth: ...owners believe that running a brush over the dog is "brushing them well".....but without getting right down to the skin they are missing the matts that are forming under all that nicely brushed top coat. when I explain how matts start...and that they need to comb the dog right down to the skin the owners eyes are opened to what they wish they had known all a long. They just dont realize how much coat they are missing when they brush them.
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doggygirl
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Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 5483
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 142.167.152.93
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 5:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a client with a silky and she gets him groomed frequently. She added a second silky and she kept telling me this one didn't need grooming as the hair isn't growing. They bath and brush and that is all it needs. Ok.. so it is 8 months old now and she brings the dog in for nails. I can see as she carries it in, it is matted. I do the nails and then take my big blue comb and place the comb at skin level, just under the knots. The comb sticks and I said "try combing that out".. She tries and says "OMG. I'm a bad Mom" and I told her she wasn't a bad Mom but this dog needs to be groomed. Amazingly I had it all brushed out in about 20 minutes as she watched. She pre-booked BOTH dogs for 4 weeks:-) both dogs were from a puppymill so unlikely that breeder told them of any grooming the dogs may require but they are good clients. She said "sure it's disturbing how many dogs are at this place..but it's clean" and I said "well if that is all you require from a breeder. that is the place for you"..LOL! I thought I was very diplomatic---:-)
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mattypdog
Registered Member
Username: mattypdog

Post Number: 108
Registered: 3-2007
Posted From: 216.95.115.72
Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 6:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about those doodle owners that come in with "instructions" printed from the internet on how to groom a doodle. They drive me crazy. The pictures of the doodles on there are matted messes, but to them they look long and curly!!! Grrr....those breeders drive me crazy!!
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winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 54
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 65.166.54.44
Posted on Friday, May 1, 2009 - 12:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hello groomers! :-)
It has been a while since I've lurked over here on the Groomers BBS. I'm still Winnie's groomer. The other day a doodle owner jokingly asked if I would groom their dog. I declined. I do enjoy grooming my own dog, but I don't think I'd like the pressure of getting it right in the owner's eyes. (Much respect for you groomers who do this day in / day out.)

Anyhow, mattypdog mentions doodle grooming "instructions." I helped develop some instructions a while back. It is mostly an attempt to help the client and the groomer communicate. Winnie is the apricot colored "before" dog, and the "eyes short trim" dog. (That pic is from when she was done professionally.) This is the finished product:

http://idog.biz/QuickDownloads/Professional%20Groomer%20Inst.pdf

I hope this is not the instructions that mattypdog is referring to. When we developed these instructions, we sought input from a professional groomer who owns two doodles. What do you think of this guide? Has anyone brought it to you? Do you have suggestions for improvement?
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rpg
Registered Member
Username: rpg

Post Number: 1272
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 199.246.2.9
Posted on Friday, May 1, 2009 - 12:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think it is well done.... my only thing with it is that all the dogs look the same; which is not the case with then entire litters of Golden/Poodle mixes or Lab/Poodle mixes....
I have them come in looking like a Golden or a Lab or like a Poodle..... all the dgs on the webpage look identical. To me it is just not being realistic to the general public. The people who don't know any better..........
I would love to see some pictures on there (or anywhere) showing all the ways these mixes can look.
The ones who really resemble the Golden or the Lab.... or the Poodle.......
No offense meant, but it is realistic :o)
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progroom
Registered Member
Username: progroom

Post Number: 6275
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 67.65.59.159
Posted on Friday, May 1, 2009 - 2:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think it look great. It is missing something I consider very important. There really needs to be some type of remarks on the outcome depending on the condition of the coat.

As I'm sure you've noticed reading here, a lot of owners do not do a thorough job combing and brushing their Doodles. Don't get me wrong, it's not just Doodle owners, it's a large majority of new pet owners.

I have seen some breed pages, usually for some of the designer mixes, that state a groomer is lazy if they do not leave several inches of coat. That kind of mentality leads to some unsatisfactory experiences at the groomer.

So my suggestion would be to add in an area for at home maintenance in order to allow the groomer to achieve the look of the beautiful dogs in the pictures. :-)

Barb
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amysuz
Registered Member
Username: amysuz

Post Number: 69
Registered: 1-2009
Posted From: 204.107.47.109
Posted on Friday, May 1, 2009 - 3:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think the instructions are great, except I noticed it says not to use clippers on the top of the head or face. Well, I've read a number of times on this board and other places that it's perfectly fine to use a long comb attachment with clippers to set the length on both areas. And then you can follow up with thinning shears. I think this is especially helpful on a dog that hasn't been groomed in many months and needs the length taken down significantly.
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doggygirl
Registered Member
Username: doggygirl

Post Number: 5735
Registered: 9-2002
Posted From: 142.167.131.13
Posted on Friday, May 1, 2009 - 7:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

sexual organs? LOL! Maybe it's me but I'd just put "privates"..Maybe I'm too prudish.
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distinctivedog
Registered Member
Username: distinctivedog

Post Number: 189
Registered: 2-2005
Posted From: 98.212.69.215
Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 10:46 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Speaking of different coat types, my boss groomed a labradoodle today that could almost have been mistaken for a German Wire-haired Pointer. It would be nice if they all looked like that!
Brandi
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magnolia
Registered Member
Username: magnolia

Post Number: 3125
Registered: 7-2000
Posted From: 76.31.131.97
Posted on Tuesday, May 5, 2009 - 11:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a client with 2 doodles both from the same litter. One looks identical to the one Bbird posted the other is grey/black color, huge and looks identical to an Irish Wolfhound. I like grooming her she doesn't take as long but the other one takes foreverrrrr.
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blangford
Registered Member
Username: blangford

Post Number: 1
Registered: 6-2010
Posted From: 98.67.223.120
Posted on Thursday, June 3, 2010 - 10:50 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am just beginning to groom from home. I have done so on few occasions, but with needing to cut costs and having 6 dogs I bought a clipper. I have a yorkie poo that I like to keep a teddy bear cut and 3 mixed breeds that have VERY thick wavy/curly hair. I bought #5 blades to clip the yorkie poo. Can I use the Blocking blade on the others due to their thick matted coats? {They are outside dogs and the yorkie poo isn't.) Can I use the blocking blade to trim Yorkie poo's anal/underbelly areas? If you have advise on trimming please give it!!
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progroom
Registered Member
Username: progroom

Post Number: 7748
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 66.143.34.134
Posted on Sunday, June 6, 2010 - 7:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've not used a blocking blade so I have no advice there. A 10 blade will work for the Yorkiepoo's sanitary areas.

It will be short, but would also probably do a nice job on the heavy coated outside dogs too.

Barb
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bbird
Registered Member
Username: bbird

Post Number: 1056
Registered: 3-2000
Posted From: 69.9.27.18
Posted on Sunday, June 6, 2010 - 7:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Blocking blades are very much like the original skip tooth blades. They can easily cut skin. One website says of the Andis blocking blades: "Not recommended for use directly against a dog's skin." Please be very careful. Don't force these blades through matted coat. You could cut your dog.

I would NOT use this on a yorkie poo tummy and privates. I'd get a separate #10 blade.
BBird writes for groomers - http://Groomblog.blogspot.com
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niki_rickett
Moderator
Username: niki_rickett

Post Number: 1012
Registered: 1-2003
Posted From: 209.23.97.78
Posted on Monday, June 7, 2010 - 6:36 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dang, my tongue hurts!!!!
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love_our_doodle
Registered Member
Username: love_our_doodle

Post Number: 1
Registered: 9-2010
Posted From: 98.163.73.1
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 7:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What great information. Thank you all for your comments. Any suggestions of products to use for our sweet Makana? I always feel bad about pulling on his knots.... Will ask the groomer we are using as well. Also what about letting his hair grow for winter...we are in Virginia now ... just moved here from Hawaii.
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progroom
Registered Member
Username: progroom

Post Number: 7963
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 66.142.40.83
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 7:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The best way is to try to get him brushed and combed before the knots form. On most coats, a thorough brushing followed by a combing once a week does a good job of keeping them tangle free.

If he is a house dog, there is really no need to grow him out longer for winter. He'll just do his business outside really quickly when it's cold. :-)

Barb
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wizardofpaws
Registered Member
Username: wizardofpaws

Post Number: 2536
Registered: 7-2007
Posted From: 209.86.226.61
Posted on Sunday, September 19, 2010 - 7:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yup. I agree with what Barb said. The most important thing to remember is frequent brushing/combing so the hair that gets tangled with each other doesn't 'clump' to form a matt in the first place. If you are finding a lot of matts you need to comb more or get a shorter clip. Also, if you are bathing at home at all be sure to comb out ALL matts BEFORE you put him in the tub, unless you also have a high-velocity dryer to dry him with. On matts that slip by you use a silicone-based de-matting spray such as Ice on Ice by Chris Christensen, Quicker Slicker, or The Stuff. A little bit goes a long way with these products.

And yes, if he is kept indoors there is really no need to let him grow out for the winter. It will just be harder to maintain and can lead to the necessity of a spring-time shave down!
A good friend will come bail you out of jail. A GREAT friend will be there sitting beside you saying "Man, that was fun!"
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landslyde
Registered Member
Username: landslyde

Post Number: 1
Registered: 12-2011
Posted From: 99.125.181.20
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2011 - 8:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am very grateful for all your input re: grooming Doodles. I groom brother/sister Labradoodles with very different coat types. The girl is easy as can be to groom. The boy is impossible!! He has a very heavy, THICK coat of hair. It mats and tangles in the blink of an eye and I practically cry every time I groom him. Last time he was in I had to shave his legs because of the mats. Next time I'm going to try The Stuff on him, and I plan on purchasing a Chris Christiansen 16mm T-brush. The owner just asked me if I knew of a good way to keep her dogs coats from icing up in the snow. Any suggestions? Would The Stuff help?
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progroom
Registered Member
Username: progroom

Post Number: 9688
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 66.136.148.59
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2011 - 8:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Have you tried Show Season's Results Rinse on the impossible coat?
It does a fantastic job of really lifting and separating the hairs.
I use it at about an ounce or so per gallon of water. I pour it on after shampooing and rinsing, let it sit a minute, then rinse.
I LOVE it!

Barb
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m__m
Registered Member
Username: m__m

Post Number: 47
Registered: 9-2009
Posted From: 24.137.78.234
Posted on Tuesday, December 13, 2011 - 9:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you can figure out something to stop the snowballs on a doodle, you can retire because THAT will be a lucrative market!! The only thing I've heard owners claim work is a bodysuit (and yes, some do use them). Musher's wax works for between the pads of the feet but if it's that wet, sticky snow when the temp is close to freezing, nothing short of a bodysuit is going to stop it from snowballing.

I use a good silicone grooming spray with weekly brushing and sadly, it does not prevent snowballs.
Wag more, bark less
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danijades
Registered Member
Username: danijades

Post Number: 41
Registered: 5-2011
Posted From: 66.25.235.43
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 8:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ok I saw the doodle groom page, one question.. What the heck is the deal with "tunneling" on the doodles? I really dont understand how it helps any to be honest? Is this only a southeast texas thing?
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progroom
Registered Member
Username: progroom

Post Number: 9915
Registered: 2-1999
Posted From: 65.70.156.107
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 9:12 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By tunneling, do you mean clipping the underside from the armpits back?

I do that on a lot of dogs. Those are areas that matt easily, don't often get brushed well, and are hidden if the coat is left with any length. It makes my job much easier. :-)

Barb
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m__m
Registered Member
Username: m__m

Post Number: 50
Registered: 9-2009
Posted From: 142.239.254.11
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 9:23 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you mean to clip an air channel under the ears? Some do this to improve air circulation in an attempt to lessen ear infections, especially in warm humid weather. Certainly can't hurt... just clip a vertical strip on the side of the head under the ear short and it's covered by the ear when it falls, so you can't really see it.
Wag more, bark less
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sandy
Registered Member
Username: sandy

Post Number: 3301
Registered: 6-1999
Posted From: 99.2.40.253
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 9:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We used to call that a "shell" clip. Shave the whole underside, typically on a drop coated, matted dog, and just leave a "fringe" to brush and trim. This was back in the days when I had no say in shop policy, whether to de matt or not. Anyway it was easier to dematt the fringe than the whole coat, I'll say that.
Dog Groomer...the meek should not apply!
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wolfhound
Registered Member
Username: wolfhound

Post Number: 982
Registered: 3-2002
Posted From: 74.170.250.50
Posted on Thursday, January 26, 2012 - 10:00 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We do a lot of 'shell clips'. With the beach and lakes, and the summer heat, we do get a lot of dogs matted on the undersides. It's easier on the dogs and us.
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danijades
Registered Member
Username: danijades

Post Number: 43
Registered: 5-2011
Posted From: 66.25.235.43
Posted on Friday, January 27, 2012 - 7:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yes m_m like you say it in a way... yet they want me to continue to shave underneath the chin and neck.... you know how you shave a V at the neck on a poodle face? that up to the ears.. and leaving a teddy face. clipping in front of the ear makes since to me which I do. I wish I had a picture of it, it looks goofy but the owners LOVE it

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