Please visit and support our valued sponsors!
Our Valued Sponsors
in the GROOMERS LOUNGE the Groomers Directory
and the Grooming Schools Directory

Non sponsor links and/or advertising is prohibited

Ideas for goldendoodle groom Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Groomers BBS » Breed Styles and Grooming Techniques » MIXED-BREED GROOMING » Ideas for goldendoodle groom « Previous Next »

  Thread Last Poster Posts Pages Last Post
Archive through July 31, 2007groomnpoodles103 7-31-07  3:30 pm
  ClosedClosed: New threads not accepted on this page        

Author Message
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 27
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 12:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi... doodle owner, DIY groomer, and doodle advocate here... I probably read this thread all the way through some time ago, and don't really care to debate any of the whys and wherefores of doodles, but thought this was a good spot to ask a doodle Grooming question, rather than start a new thread.

I was reading up on PWDs, and came across the description in the breed standard for the two types of clip, the "lion" and "retriever" clip. Assuming I've kept up my end of the bargain, and my doodle was matt free, if I walked into your shop and asked for a PWD "retriever clip", what would I get? Would you follow that request with some questions?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

wattadog
Registered Member
Username: wattadog

Post Number: 925
Registered: 12-2003
Posted From: 80.229.11.236
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 1:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Winnies dad~
If you came into my shop asking for a PWD retriever clip on a GD, I would first get my Notes grooming book, flip to the PWD page & show you the retriever clip pictures, & ask if "that" is what you were looking for.. then we could discuss length & any modifications you might want to make. I would also explain (depending on your dogs coat) that your dog may not look the same as a PWD once done as the coat might lay differently.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 29
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 2:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

@wattadog,
sounds reasonable to me. I know the muzzle gets trimmed on a PWD lion cut, and from the pics I've found on the 'net, the top of the head is kept long and over the eyes. What do you (normally) do with the muzzle/eyes/ears on a PWD retriever cut? As I don't own a copy of "Notes", I'm not sure what it looks like. Here's a pic from a Porti owner's site (hope this sort of link is ok.)

http://www.infive.com/WizardPics/image/10mos3.jpg

That pic is quite a bit like how I like to keep Winnie groomed. Is that pretty close to the standard for a PWD retriever cut?

How would you describe the cut in that Porti pic?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

shearmadness
Registered Member
Username: shearmadness

Post Number: 783
Registered: 12-2004
Posted From: 67.53.180.220
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 4:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi Winnie's Dad,
I don't recall if you've posted a picture of Winnie or not, but Portie's vary from poodle curly to a limp wave in the coat. I'd think a retriever trim would be quite doable on a Doodle coat if there's any curl at all to the coat.
The only problem I could see is if Winnie has a larger ear. You might not get that nice rounded shape to the head without making it overly large.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

peg
Registered Member
Username: peg

Post Number: 314
Registered: 3-1999
Posted From: 24.222.216.173
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 5:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

>>Assuming I've kept up my end of the bargain, and my doodle was matt free, if I walked into your shop and asked for a PWD "retriever clip", what would I get? <<

One very happy groomer! You'd have picked a style that, IMO, suits the coat and shape of most doodles. A style that is much easier to maintain than full coat. A style that I've heard of LOL. I would likely show you pictures in my copy of "Notes" and in magazines and ask; do you want the ears that short? Do you want the muzzle that short? do you want the tail done the same? At least we'd be on the "same page" to start so that we could adjust as needed for your tastes and your dog's shape!
Peg
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

groomnpoodles
Registered Member
Username: groomnpoodles

Post Number: 948
Registered: 3-2002
Posted From: 71.32.153.91
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 9:18 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Winnie's picture is on his profile with Dad!
Grooming under the Tetons
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

clipperscorner
Registered Member
Username: clipperscorner

Post Number: 54
Registered: 1-2008
Posted From: 209.161.214.160
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 11:05 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I myself don't think ckc should not give goldendoddles or labradoddles a ckc label. The breeders are trying. They are just x mixes. Not only that but what will be come of the true breeds when breeders keep x mixing. We almost lost the golden ret and they were comming out as nasty biters ?.
Clipperscorner- Ann
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 30
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 69.138.11.54
Posted on Thursday, March 6, 2008 - 11:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess the main reason behind my question is that it seems so often that there are two big problems with doodle grooming.

Problem A is the fact that doodle people tend to like the shaggy look, but often are unwilling or just don't know what is necessary to keep that look. The solution to that problem is usually the shock treatment of a "smoothie" followed by education. (I'm not really addressing problem A here, I'm working more towards the other issue.)

Problem B is the communication gap between owners and groomers. Many doodle owners are first-time dog owners. They haven't a clue what a 3 3/4 or a 10 blade are, or what lengths they might produce, or how to communicate to a groomer what they want. This is compounded by the fact that there is no standard for them to gravitate towards. I was admiring a PWD that is part of our Therapy dog group, and thought that I liked his cut, so I guess that's how we got here! (me wondering if asking a groomer for a PWD Retriever cut for a doodle makes sense, or if it would get the results I wanted)

Anyhow, here's a pic of how I tend to cut Winnie. It is actually about 1/2" to 3/4" long on her body and legs. I don't do anything to her tail (beyond the first 2 or 3 inches), and leave her head and beard a little longer. Nevermind my "frugal" grooming table. I've got a real table now.

A "short PWD retriever cut"?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

wizardofpaws
Registered Member
Username: wizardofpaws

Post Number: 263
Registered: 7-2007
Posted From: 207.69.140.23
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 8:09 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

winnie's dad--Do you cut her yourself then? If so, you do a great job! Actually better than a couple of groomers I have worked with during my career! Stylisticly I personally would leave her legs a bit longer, but what you have is MUCH easier for an owner to maintain.

I gotta tell you--you are the exception when it comes to goldendoodle owners. Most that I deal with have very unreasonable expectations. And you are most certainly right about the 'comunication gap'. Many 'doodle owners I have dealt with come in and tell me that the "breeder" they purchased their dog from told them that the coat was 'maintenance free' and never would need to be clipped and would never shed! So they waltz into my shop when the dog is 2 years old never having been groomed and ask for me to just brush it out and "leave him shaggy". Yeah, right. I can do that as soon as monkeys fly out my butt--sorry your dog will be naked! Most recently I had a lady with 2 150lb'ers come in. When she scheduled with me she complained to me that no groomer that she had found could do them 'right'. Or "to breed standard" as she put it. Anyway, she comes in with these 2 and they are matted dirty messes! She keeps them in her yard and only gets them groomed once they are completely grown out from their smoothie clips. She claimed that she brushes them at home but it takes her 3 days to brush each one completely out (yeah, sure, it looked like 3 days to completely surface brush them). It took me 6 HOURS to bathe and dry both dogs and finish groom one. I had to make her bring the one I didn't finish in 2 days later. I was able to get a 3/4" blade all over the one and the other I actually was able to do in a #C gaurd with completely scissored legs. It was A LOT OF WORK! I honered the original price I had qoted her ($45!) but really gave her an eye-opener. I told her I COULD do what she requested but ONLY IF SHE BROUGHT THE DOGS IN EVERY OTHER WEEK FOR A BATH/BRUSH and every other appointment would be their groom and it would be $65 for the groom and $40 for the bath/brush. Otherwise, if she brought the dogs in like that to me again, I would either have to shave them bald like every other groomer she had been to (for $75) OR if she wanted them to look good as I had done them that day, I would have to charge her $150 per dog. So I did give her MANY choices on how to get what she wanted. But this obviously hasn't been good enough because she hasn't been back. After my re-education speel, she mentioned that she would like me to 'teach her' how to groom them herself. OK, lady, if it takes you 3 DAYS to brush 1 dog, (and not even brushed out sufficently at that) how long will it take you to actully GROOM them? She quibbled with me about "well, maybe if I had the right tools. . .?" I let her know that getting a table sturdy enough to hold her 150lb'ers would be at least $500 right there and a dryer powerful enough to go through all that coat would be another $200-$400 . . . etc, etc. But, maybe she decided $1000 for supplies would be cheaper than coming to my shop . . . who knows? But my point is, that yes, there is a HUGE communication gap between 'doodle owners' expectations and the groomers that are unfortunate enough to have to deal with these types. We do our best, but we aren't magicians! (Even though I am a 'wizard'! LOL!) I just wish there were more like you out there winnie's dad!

BTW, if you are thinking of having winnie professionally groomed, yes, I think comparing what you want to the PWD 'retriever' clip would get you exactly what you want. Or better yet, you could bring in the above pic of her to show the groomer and discuss any changes you would want her to make. (ie, longer, shorter, here or there, etc.)

Again, I gotta say kudos to you on that groom. the feet and head need a little work (and that's no biggie), but besides that the body and legs look terrific!
A good friend will come bail you out of jail. A GREAT friend will be there sitting beside you saying "Man, that was fun!"
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

underdog
Registered Member
Username: underdog

Post Number: 910
Registered: 4-2003
Posted From: 69.46.213.54
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 8:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess what I would do is ask that Portie's owner who they take their dog to & what their name is so you can ask for the same cut. Does that help?
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

nkswen
Registered Member
Username: nkswen

Post Number: 542
Registered: 10-2001
Posted From: 72.218.225.50
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 8:25 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

No, that picture isn't what a PWD should look like. Check out the differences in this link.

http://www.sidyboysfoolin.com/Promo/CamlinSeadancerPWDs.html

Ears have to be shortened, muzzle shortened, not shaved and blended into cheeks. Topknot is rounded and a visor is over the eyes. Body lenght is usually 1 inch, but that varies with my customers. Tail is trimmed short with tassle left at bend. Winnie would look fine.

I appreciate your description of Doodle owners. You hit that nail right on the head. Most of my clients have conformed to regular grooming but I still have a few hold outs that refuse to get it and get all big eyed and shocked at the time of shavedown. Oh well..can't please everyone ALL the time!
"Listen to what I mean, not what I say."
- Me
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 31
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 11:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

everyone,
Thanks for the comments! I don't plan to bring Winnie to a groomer, I kinda enjoy doing it myself. Maybe every once in a while, but the main reason I'm asking is because I'm fairly active in the doodle community, and I'm trying to help educate doodle owners about grooming. I will eventually prepare a writeup/article, and ask you folks to comment, if you'd be willing.

I was hoping I'd stumbled across any easy common denominator or point of reference with the PWD retriever cut, but nkswen (thank you) has shown an example that is probably a little more stylized than what most doodle owners would want. I guess the best bet is for an owner to bring in some pictures of grooms they like, and to discuss with the groomer the current condition of the coat, and a) if that cut is possible and b) what needs to be done if it is not and c) what should be done in the future to establish and maintain the look the owner wants.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

scissorart
Registered Member
Username: scissorart

Post Number: 452
Registered: 4-2006
Posted From: 70.234.168.67
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 1:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The picture you posted to me looks like an all over scissor of the same length and a teddy bear head. That is just what I would call it. I have never groomed a PWD but their is a difference with the clip the black dog that someone else posted and the picture you posted. It looks to me that the coat you posted is maybe an inch to inch and a half long. So people should talk to their groomer and say they want it that long with a teddy bear head. That is easier than saying a PWD clip, which many many groomers aren't familiar with and so many doodle owners wouldn't be able to upkeep that groom. In my opinion anyway. There aren't any PWD's around here so not many groomers are familiar with the clip. LOL.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

scissorart
Registered Member
Username: scissorart

Post Number: 453
Registered: 4-2006
Posted From: 70.234.168.67
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 1:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I meant are not familar with the clip
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

nkswen
Registered Member
Username: nkswen

Post Number: 543
Registered: 10-2001
Posted From: 72.218.225.50
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 5:09 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

winnies dad
Since you're the one doing the grooming you can experiment. Google PWD and get a look at the head. They have a very short muzzle, then shorten the ears. Round the back of the ear, but don't cut into the front. Take alittle off here and there and find what works. Don't be afraid to go really tight to Winnies lips, just be careful. If you don't have any thinners, get a pair and use them to shape her snout. Take quite a bit off. If you look at your picture, take all that hair short on her nose..sort of like a bottle brush scrubber. I do a short face on a few Doodles and their owners love it. Just do the body the way your already grooming winnie.
"Listen to what I mean, not what I say."
- Me
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

doginsuds
Registered Member
Username: doginsuds

Post Number: 41
Registered: 10-2003
Posted From: 12.207.176.155
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 9:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I agree with missema. I am sure these dogs are very loving pets, but who knows with all this mix "specialized" breeding going on what the consequences might be later on health wise. What used to be mixed breeds that are given away, are now extremely high priced muts. Go figure. I'm not bashing REPUTABLE breeders at all. But, this has really gotten out of hand. I just think the pricing for these dogs is totaly bogus and outrageous. It's the designer dog thing. Everyone wants the very new and different. Give me a purebred (not cool right now) Black Lab anyday! By the way missema, you are right on and very funny.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

louie
Registered Member
Username: louie

Post Number: 2774
Registered: 5-2001
Posted From: 67.80.249.139
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 10:08 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

www.goldendoodles.com/Resource/groomingdoods.htm

OMG this photo and groom makes ME want a doodle!

i love the ears not long and shaggy and i love the tail and just how simple, but elegant the groom is!
"Happiness is a warm puppy" --Charles Schulz
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

louie
Registered Member
Username: louie

Post Number: 2775
Registered: 5-2001
Posted From: 67.80.249.139
Posted on Friday, March 7, 2008 - 10:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Winnie's dad: you should be very proud of the work you are doing with your doodle:-)

You also seem to be a fabulous groomer!

I think is she were my dog, I would love to try a lion trim like the portie can get:-)..the lion coloring on doodles would make a fantastic look for that style groom....

"Happiness is a warm puppy" --Charles Schulz
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

winnies_dad
Registered Member
Username: winnies_dad

Post Number: 32
Registered: 2-2007
Posted From: 198.232.250.22
Posted on Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - 12:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I don't know if I'm brave enough to do a lion cut. One of these days, when I'm really tired of the "same old same old" cut, I'll break down and do it. Either a lion or make her into a ponydoodle, but you're right louie, her coloring lends itself to the lion look.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

nakedbacon
Registered Member
Username: nakedbacon

Post Number: 601
Registered: 7-2002
Posted From: 208.101.91.2
Posted on Tuesday, March 11, 2008 - 1:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

lol @ ponydoodle...

I personally never want to groom one of those! hehe...

goldendoodles, lab-doodles... sure.. but ponydoodles... ack! Thanks for the laugh, Winnie's Dad. :-)
"I bet the last time you were sorry was when you had to use the pay toilet and the string to your pet dime broke!!"

"If you're too tense, reduce to one-fifth."
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

bbird
Registered Member
Username: bbird

Post Number: 456
Registered: 3-2000
Posted From: 69.9.27.166
Posted on Wednesday, March 12, 2008 - 7:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Winnie's Dad! Excellent work, want a job? Just kidding, but I am impressed. Personally, I think the PWD Retriever Clip is an excellent choice for many a Goldendoodle. They tend to have a rather flat, elongated head, and by leaving more on the top, and taking it shorter under the chin and shortening the ears, it gives a great look with a little more balance. I am working on getting more of a PWD look on my favorite Doodle client, Gracie.

Here she is on the way to more of a PWD style. It will take another groom to get it shaped up, and this Doodle will never look exactly like the proper PWD. It does, however, seem like a viable alternative for this dog, and the owners were very happy.

Goldendoodle as PWDGracie Doodle PWD Head
BBird writes for groomers - http://Groomblog.blogspot.com
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

princessfoofoo2u
Registered Member
Username: princessfoofoo2u

Post Number: 312
Registered: 9-2007
Posted From: 69.253.219.125
Posted on Wednesday, March 12, 2008 - 4:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Louie- I love that pic of the goldndoodle groom too. I think I might print it out and put it in my "Big Binder fo grooming Info". After a few miscommunications with clients I started collecting pics of various grooms and lengths and styles and putting them in a three ring binder so I have a visual aid.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

joeypoodle
Registered Member
Username: joeypoodle

Post Number: 12
Registered: 5-2008
Posted From: 155.91.28.231
Posted on Thursday, May 15, 2008 - 9:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm not a pro groomer... just have an interest since I have a Standard Poo... But doesn't it depend on the coat as to how to groom a doodle? I mean if you get a coat that has guard hairs and a curly undercoat, don't you want to forgoe shaving and just do a brush-out? Wouldn't you only want to shave single-coated varieties that got their hair from the poodle side?

I heard one groomer say that it was easier to keep a Standard Poodle in Continental trim than it was to properly groom a doodle.
Top of pagePrevious messageNext messageBottom of page Link to this message

judicantu
Registered Member
Username: judicantu

Post Number: 2
Registered: 2-2008
Posted From: 98.199.2.84
Posted on Sunday, July 6, 2008 - 9:59 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have been grooming Doodles in this style for years. I have found it very functional and it gives these pets a really nice look. Depending on the generation of breeding, many doodles tend to have very strong muscular shoulders and chests, which make them perfect candidates for this groom. I'm actually doing a seminar on it at Pet Quest next week and a how to layout for a Wahl ad in Groomer to Groomer.
I have some doodles that people actually think are PWD. Espcially some of the smaller bred doodles.
As a groomer I love the doodle. I groom many of them and their owners are eager to work with me and understand how much work it takes to care for their dogs.

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Bold text Italics Underline Create a hyperlink Insert a clipart image

Username: Posting Information:
This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Password:
Options: Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action:
Copyright 1995-2010 The Groomers Lounge, All rights reserved.
No reproduction without the express written permission of the GL and/or the original poster.